Ohio mayor says local partnerships with feds on immigration ‘starting to ramp up’

Jeff Bennett:

As the Trump administration ramps up deportation efforts nationwide, ICE has increasingly turned to local law enforcement through a program known as 287(g), which has been around for nearly 30 years.

Under these agreements, sheriff’s offices can detain illegal immigrants in local jails before deporting or transferring them. In some cases, officers are trained to participate directly in ICE operations. Since January, the number of such agreements has increased by more than 640 percent.

In Butler County, Ohio, Sheriff Richard Jones restored his county’s partnership with the federal government when President Trump returned to office. Since then, the county has housed nearly 2,000 ICE detainees in its jails.

And Sheriff Jones joins us now.

Thank you for being with us.

Richard Jones, Butler County, Ohio, Sheriff:

Yes sir. How are you today?

Jeff Bennett:

I’m fine. Thank you.

So, as I understand it, you have partnered and, in some cases, departed from partnerships on immigration enforcement with the federal government across five presidencies. So, from your perspective, how does the Trump administration’s approach to immigration compare to what you’ve seen and experienced under previous administrations?

Richard Jones:

This is very simple. Under Biden, it was negligible.

I kicked them out for the four years they were there. The largest number of deportations we ever did when we had 287(g), the enforcement model, and the incarceration model was under President Obama. He was there eight years. So he’s deported a lot more people than Trump has in about five years.

Jeff Bennett:

How do you think people misunderstand deportations during the Obama era compared to the current moment?

Richard Jones:

I think that’s in the past. It’s history. Depending on the TV channels or where they get the news, they believe whichever group they watch.

But the actual fact is that I’ve been working on deportation and on illegal immigration for almost 22 years, five presidents, and I’ve actually been there. We deported when President Obama was president, eight years – he had eight years. President Trump has gone to five. So he has a lot of catching up to do.

But — in the United States, about 78% are Democrats or Republicans, black or white. About 78 percent, during the last election, wanted the border closed, and they wanted something done regarding deportation. President Trump is doing exactly what he said he would do. He would start these programs and do the migration.

Jeff Bennett:

You know, there are critics who argue that Section 287(g) opens the door to racial profiling, especially in traffic stops and street-level enforcement operations. So what specific safeguards do you have in place to make sure that your deputies don’t use that authority to target people based on their appearance or the language they speak?

Richard Jones:

Listen, we’ve been doing this since the beginning of time. We stop people who are black, white, red, every color in the rainbow, and every religion. It doesn’t matter what type of vehicle they drive. We just don’t do traffic enforcement. We always enforce traffic laws.

These are other issues. You commit a crime, you drive drunk, just like everyone else, just like local criminals do, and we don’t look at color or religion or anything like that. But people can believe what they want to believe. I couldn’t – if I was on your show for 24 hours nonstop, I couldn’t convince the naysayers.

Jeff Bennett:

But what specific policies or safeguards do you have in place to make sure people aren’t stopped based on their appearance or the language they speak?

Richard Jones:

Basically, we monitor all their stopping points. And we always have. We monitor their stops. We are reviewing. We meet them. But we’ve been doing this for 22 years since we had cameras and before that. We always look at their reports, just as they do across the country.

Jeff Bennett:

Tell us what has changed in your prisons since you re-engaged with the federal government under this program. On a typical day now, how many detainees does ICE house? What does this mean for the space available for local guests?

Richard Jones:

This is very simple.

Today, I think we’ve reached 360. It’s different. Sometimes, as many as 300. We had as many as 430 inmates at ICE. Depends on what they do at ICE. And we had about 500. So it varies depending on what they’re doing.

Jeff Bennett:

You said federal contracts as part of this program brought in more than $200 million over 20 years. It expects to reach a quarter of a billion dollars by 2027. Is this true?

Richard Jones:

This is true, perhaps more so. If you listen to Homeland Security officials, they suspect there are 20 to 30 million people here. They need county jails for jail space. They do not have – The federal government does not have county jails or federal prisons. They rely on county sheriff’s offices.

And next year, we think we’ll bring in $22 million, just next year. This year, we will probably have 12 people attending, but the numbers are just starting to grow.

Jeff Bennett:

There are people who will hear these numbers and conclude that Butler County has a financial incentive to keep beds full of ICE detainees.

Richard Jones:

Well, I’m sure of it. I housed prisoners here. I don’t do it for free. If other counties want to house prisoners here, they have to pay the going rate. They don’t have to come here. But do we do it for free? No, there’s a price they have to pay to keep them here, just like they always have.

We’ve had marshals for probably 20 or 30 years. They pay. We don’t do it for free. It helps cover the shipping of our local prisoners. So, no, it’s – it is what it is.

Jeff Bennett:

ICE has come under renewed scrutiny, as you well know, across the country for what many people view as aggressive and, in some cases, brutal tactics.

Do you think the way ICE is detaining some of these people is the best way to remove people who are in the country illegally, but pose no threat to public safety?

Richard Jones:

Well, they all snuck into the country. They are here illegally. If they don’t want to be here, go home. They try to show them places where they will ship to you and give you money to get you home. You are here illegally. You shouldn’t be here.

The president ran into this building, and he’s keeping his word. To stop this in these major cities, I had 500 or more protesters here. They protest all the time here in front of my prison. They chain ourselves to the door. Do you know what changes? Nothing at all.

I agree with the way they are doing it and it will continue to escalate. They actually take up more space in the prison. I support them 110 percent.

Jeff Bennett:

Sheriff Richard Jones, thank you for your views. We appreciate that.

Richard Jones:

Hey, appreciate you. Thank you.